Nag-Screens
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I'm not sure how valid your argument is here. In my experience as a solutions architect, the companies who can afford support will end up buying it simply for the peace of mind. Smaller companies who can't afford it, wont buy it (with or without the nag screens).
Secondly, if someone is building from source, chances are they're smart enough to realize there are many ways to remove those nag screens if you just think about it for a moment. I've personally removed all the "nags" on my lab server since I have no need/use for support, however, if a client wanted it I would happily recommend it.
Lastly, In my opinion those nag screens only push people away from a technology and find alternatives (i.e. Proxmox).
Food for thought.
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That's not true: it happens that people doesn't know there's service coming with a software. It's not a nag screen, it shows/explains that support is available.
Also, if all companies which can afford it just purchased it, believe me we could have more subscribers
Reality is never black or white, so it's a balanced choice to make people understand there's a cost behind the software, and if you are a company, purchasing support will help the project too.Note: we don't have official numbers because there's no tracking whatsoever in version available on GitHub, but we have often some "surprises", especially since XCP-ng (people asking for help on XCP-ng, paying a reasonable amount for XCP-ng Support, and we discover XO is in production from the sources on this infrastructure: if what you said is true, that wouldn't exist at all)
Regarding the removal of those messages, if you can afford to take time to remove it because… because, you can (but I don't see the point, feel free to explain what's the issue with those messages displayed), well, good for you, you are indeed not the target anyway
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@mschumacher said in Nag-Screens:
I have to be quite honest but this motivates me much more to have a look at oVirt than to buy XCP-NG. I already gave Proxmox a try but this is, but it suffered from the exact same problem. Oh Sure, we are 100% open source, but if you want PREMIUM features you need to pay a few hundred dollars a month.
Same goes for me here. In the beginning I directly went away from XOA appliance, because of the many pages
That feature is unavailable in this version, if you like that, it's available in Version {Starter|Premium|Enterprise}.Having realized that XenOrchestra is Open Source at last after 2(?) years it was started, I baked it myself(Many thanks for the installation guide hereby!). The message
This version is not bundled with any support nor updates. Use it with caution.which is displayed on every f****** page is very annoying. I saw there's possibly a fix for it in this github issue: https://github.com/vatesfr/xen-orchestra/issues/4175
There is another presentation detail which I consider annoying and which I would like to disable:
- The red circle with a question mark at "XOA" menu entry, showing, that update information is not available.
What is acceptable / not annoying for me is...
- the yellow triangle with the words no support at the left, lower down the menu.
- an information about the version(open source, no support, bla ...) when updating or in monthly intervals
I read that is very import for Vates to inform the users about the possibility that there is commercial support available. I can understand that need to inform users so that nobody who wants support and has the budget just do not know.
But for me it's annoying and with the current state, I do not like the interface and won't recommend it to others and I kindly ask you to consider changing the policy on that topic.
When I look at the situation, I can imagine, that you really get some new customers by informing them constantly that there's support available. On the other side, you possibly loose a lot enthusiasts because of the nagging. Enthusiasts that are from the tech layer, who may have great influence on what software is being used and what not. Tech people who recommend software they like the to other users. If you have great software, anybody wants to use it. Tech people like me.
For me for example the monitoring solution check_mk is one of those software products. I got a recommendation for it and at the shared office space everyone is using it and I'm fascinated to talk to anyone interested about it and share my knowledge on the topic, because it's really great software.
I think Vates and you Olivier have earned great respect for me by starting up XCP-NG and I think you enriched the world by doing so. Thanks for that!
What regards Xen-Orchestra so far: Currently I have no strong preference for it. But that may change in future...
What regards the compare with proxmox: I think one message at a login is acceptable for me.
Regards,
forkclosed Permanent banner when running XOA from the sources #4175
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Banner can be removed now, so I don't really get your first point? Also, why reviving such an old topic just for that?
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Also, why reviving such an old topic just for that?
Because I firstly installed XO from source, got annoyed and this is the matching forum and the matching post for the issue. Lastly because you invited anyone to continue the discussion in the github issue. (https://github.com/vatesfr/xen-orchestra/issues/4430)
We are open to continue the discussion on the forum, which seems the best place to do so.
For me the issue isn't resolved. So I'm asking you for reconsidering as stated. That's why I shared my opinion about it. If you do not like my opinion nor discussion on this topic, just say a word, and I'll never bother the forum with my presence again.
closed Disable built from sources warning. #4430
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Not sure to understand: what's not solved? The top banner than you can remove now?
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@livierlambert said in Nag-Screens:
Not sure to understand: what's not solved? The top banner than you can remove now?
I just read the information about that in the mentioned github issue. I haven't tried so far. Probably this is solved.
There is another presentation detail which I consider annoying and which I would like to disable:
The red circle with a question mark at "XOA" menu entry, showing, that update
information is not available.This one is still open.
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And this red circle is bothering you? I mean, what's really bothering you/having an impact for you? The color itself? Is putting it in yellow would change something?
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Impact: Yes, it's the red circle. I just dislike alarm symbols when situation is normal. I try to remove it myself from the code as long as I do not intend to buy a subscription.
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Okay it's more clear now. It's not what you like/dislike but potential confusions with alerts that make sense (this is a rational point that I can hear, vs "I dislike" which is a personal opinion). Anyway, that's what I wanted to understand. I'll discuss with the team about a solution.
Thanks for the feedback.
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Thanks Olivier for your clear feedback. I so experienced you are open to - even critical feedback - and realize you tried to understand my point of view. So I'm motivated to provide the feedback to the other points where I think things can be improved(in a new thread).
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Regarding the UI in general? We started to work on XO 6 anyway, so everything will change
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@livierlambert said in Nag-Screens:
Not sure to understand: what's not solved? The top banner than you can remove now?
Hi Olivier, did I miss something?
Is there other way of doing this the one described on GitHub(which btw looks to be outdated?)? -
There's a cross on top right to dismiss it.
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But it will show next time you go to XOA on new cart. I thought you meant ease way to permanently remove it from sources like described here https://github.com/vatesfr/xen-orchestra/issues/4175#issuecomment-488320434
closed Permanent banner when running XOA from the sources #4175
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As we said there, we found a compromise: ability to remove it. So you won't have any space lost after dismissing it.
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Link to the descriptions to patch the disclaimer away:
https://github.com/FoxieHazmat/xenorchestraSourceBannerFix/issues/1
and to the script that does it for you(tested with XO 5.44.1):
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You could break at any time after an update because the layout changed for any reason.This amount of effort to contribute could have been done to actually improve the software. At least try to bring other contributions. Open Source is not just taking, it's also giving.
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Open Source is not just taking, it's also giving.
Yes, I totally agree. I'll have a look at the bugtracker to see what's to be done.
Are there any open tasks for a person like me with some scripting skills?
Open Source is also not about fighting against its users, I thought!
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Indeed, but "our" Open Source is fully independent from Facebook, Google or other big corps than can just throw their technology in Open Source because they have almost unlimited money to support it.
Without our paid users, there's no Xen Orchestra nor XCP-ng at all (remember that currently XO revenue is still paying for XCP-ng dev).
Having some removable banners displayed is just a small price to pay to enjoy both software without paying anything. I thought people would understand that. This means:
- a fraction of companies using it that could pay will see that and maybe change their mind
- others (home users) will just have to click on a cross to close it
I think this is a very reasonable amount of things to "endure" to get all the rest for free.
XO wasn't built by the community, despite everything is fully open since the start: so we are completely offering it to everyone without any counterpart.
